Author Topic: Music of Excalibur  (Read 3945 times)

Offline L.

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Music of Excalibur
« on: January 02, 2011, 07:29:06 PM »


Excalibur's Music Lead, Johannes Klatt (pictured), explains the work, software and inspiration behind the project's muscial score.


Hello, my name is Johannes but everyone calls me "Yogi". I am 27 years old and from Germany. I am the Music Lead for Star Trek: Excalibur. I first got into music composition as a side-trade when I was active as a sound designer and voice producer in the FreeSpace 2 modding community. I just played around with sequencers and that eventually got me hooked. Since then I have contributed to a number of mostly non-commercial projects. My "instrument" is a Terratec MIDI Master USB keyboard. It is actually a beginner’s keyboard with quite a few shortcomings, but it is very reliable. Additionally I have a t.bone SCT-700 microphone which I use to record live solo instruments and voices. As for software I use Cakewalk Sonar 6.2 for sequencing and the EastWest QuantumLeap Symphonic Orchestra as my primary sample library. I plan to do some extensive upgrading after Christmas.

I usually stick to orchestral game music, but sometimes I work with other types like Jazz or Pop. My wife and I once wrote a musical for a university course. Hell of a lot of work, but it was totally worth the effort.

Excalibur will feature a fully dynamic music system based on some very unique and cutting-edge software. It will generate ambient music according to the current status of the gameplay which is put together by tiny music segments. We’re going to see tranquil journeys, intense space battles and much in between and the music is going to reflect that. Further information on this tech will make an appearance by the end of the year. Personally I hope that by the release of Excalibur we will have composed and recorded around two to three hours of music. We already have themes laid out for the major locations, characters and events of the game. And of course the Excalibur needs her own theme! Composing it was actually my probationary task that got me into the Excalibur team, so that one has already been recorded in a preview version for a while now. We’ll most likely re-record it later with newer libraries.

You unavoidably run into composer's block on occasion. It helps to have a wide range of music to listen to. But a good portion of composing is not just inspiration but the actual craftsmanship. Putting all the pieces together, making them work as a whole. That also involves orchestration and a lot to tweaking get the sound right. And that’s a thing you have to learn by experience - just like programming, drawing or modelling.

My personal all-time Star Trek composer is James Horner. In my opinion he nailed Star Trek the best. I especially liked his fast movements in Star Trek II and III. Since the game takes place in our beloved TNG timeline an important source of inspiration is, of course, Jerry Goldsmith. He musically shaped a big portion of Star Trek and we refer to his themes here and there. They somehow have a canonical quality. The dark score of Star Trek VI by Cliff Eidelmann was surely also an important factor in the franchise since it showed that slightly different music works quite well. Another source of inspiration is Danny Pelfrey who created a bunch of fantastic scores for numerous Star Trek video games. I am probably causing some disturbance in the force, but Michael Giacchino is also an inspiration. Some people say that his score for Star Trek (2009) isn't suitable at all, but I believe he wrote the best Star Trek theme ever. And I've got to give him credit for the creepy parts of the Excalibur's score, because he pretty much demonstrated in Lost how to do it!

You can listen to a sneak-peek of a track from Star Trek: Excalibur by clicking here.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2011, 07:35:08 PM by Lewis »

Offline AricwithanA

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2011, 07:54:36 PM »
30 seconds?  That is all I get?!?

Ok, I'll take what I can get, lol.  Though that 30 seconds did make me all excited!
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Offline Zachstar

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2011, 08:27:44 PM »
Impressive! The little bit we got to hear in my opinion captures the FEEL of Star Trek VERY well!

A few questions.

#1 What is your "listening" sound system? Card name and equipment?

#2 Would you call the system used on the old X-Wing games an inspiration for this new system?

Speaking of sound there is a discussion in the Project Discussion forum about sound engines and equipment if you wish to pwn with your knowledge :P
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Offline Aresius

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2011, 09:10:59 PM »
Hi auch from another one in Germany. ;)

Also doing some voice-cast every now and then. I recently got meself a Theremin.

Offline kevin

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2011, 12:43:16 AM »
Even with its grand and round orchestral spirit, it has to fight to be heard...      Brilliant.

Offline k_merse

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2011, 01:01:48 AM »
Impressive music!
I have one suggestion though. When I played STO, I simply couldn't feel like playing a Star Trek game, because it almost completely lacked the known Star Trek themes. I think this is one of the major mistakes the STO devs made. I just don't want to see the same in Excalibur.
I'm not saying that you should work only with known themes. On the contrary! I'm really looking forward to listen to some Excalibur themes. But there are plenty of good musics in Star Trek which could be used. For example I couldn't imagine anything nicer than approaching Deep Space 9 while listening a calm version of main DS9 theme  :)

Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2011, 04:35:04 PM »
I'm glad to read nuTrek's music as a positive influence, it's only downside was its overt repetition among pieces.

The linked piece was okay, but I'm not a fan of intermixing noise as musical elements.  I hope that's just an example of unrelated effects and tracks all at once, in that case it seems good.
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Offline Johannes

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2011, 12:02:15 AM »
Hey guys,
sorry, took me some while to reply...so here we go:

@Zachstar: My listening system...is right now just an old Creative speaker set. Don't worry, right now I am focussing on the composition. Mastering and production of the whole score will probably be done by a friend of mine who has a decent listening set. So far the stuff coming out of EWQL is pretty good from the beginning. :) Though I might update somewhere this year. As for the music system...X-Wing and TIE Fighter were both midi based *iMuse if I am not mistaken here*, which was highly adaptable and perfect for interactive music, but its pretty bad for today's sound standards. We will not build our own music system, but will use a cutting-edge music technology which has not released yet. But I can't say more on that topic right now...we'll make a big announcement once we got the system from the devs.

@Aresius: Hi! Where do you live in Germany? Do you have some background in computer based music production?

@k_merse: I don't think that ST-game composers do not want to use established themes...the problem is more a legal one. All Star Trek music is copyrighted and the game developers are not able to get the permission to use copyrighted music material they simply cannot use it. But since we are non-commercial, we'll most likely quote some themes here and there... :)

@MajorD: the short sample originally appeared as an easter egg in a Star Trek podcast, that's why there are noises and stuff. Also it helps to cover some production-insufficiencies. ;) Don't worry, in the end it all will be "normal" music. But I can't follow on nuTrek...is that a synonym for Star Trek 11?

Offline Aresius

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2011, 04:50:30 PM »
I live near Heidelberg and study in Karlsruhe, usually I'm in KA during the week (that's also where my main engine and the instruments are). I've tinkered a bit with a guitar tablature software that allowed to create midi-based music (transfering them into full mp3 worked for the most instruments, but atmospheric sounds like seawaves or birds sounded awkward). Haven't done anything lately, tho, due to the studies...

Offline stevie_d

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2011, 11:42:04 PM »
I loved it.

It *SOUNDED* star trek-ky, which a lot of star trek games (most noticably Elite Force 1 and 2) dont seem to get. It sounded more sweeping and Star Trek than even Nemesis did (Nemesis with its hard synths and mechanical overtones - bleugh).

If thats a sneak peek, then it bodes really well for the rest of the soundtrack!

Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2011, 02:04:06 PM »
nuTrek...is that a synonym for Star Trek 11?
Yep.
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Offline AricwithanA

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2011, 05:15:33 AM »
I personally prefer the JJverse.  I don't consider his work the "nuTrek" at all.  Just a sideline thing till we get back to the real stuff again!

I had a question about the music and sound effects.  Will we be getting access to all the sound/music stuff once things come out and will files be labled accordingly?  I hate it when digging through files in a game and the files are just named random crap!  lol

Otherwise, still sounds awesome.  I pull it up every so often now just to excite myself for a couple of min.  lol
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Offline BrioCyrain

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2011, 01:04:48 PM »
@Johannes

I know that you only listed "Star Trek" influences, but I would like to recommend these two tracks from a game series called "Lost Planet". Not really for the melody but what IMO has some epic sci-fi "Oomph".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNLFkNC2O5E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYHnCMPHDI4&feature=related
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Offline FekLeyrTarg

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2011, 03:23:35 AM »
Yes, X-Wing, TIE Fighter and X-Wing Alliance use the iMuse system while XWING95, TIE95 and X-Wing vs TIE Fighter use cd track music.
Btw if you are interested in the MIDIs:
http://sites.google.com/site/stephen1297/latracks
(I recommend that you play X-Wing's MIDIs with WinAmp)

I really like your sample and I look forward to listen to your completed tracks.

Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2011, 10:59:21 AM »
Since we're suggesting, I hope you go out on a limb with the music and break from purely classical themes.  My favorite game music is Mass Effect's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2dnp1x38mg&feature=related

The worst thing in music today is the overuse of base.  Just about everything keeps rhythm with a base line, and all it does is distract from the music. I think base should only be used as punctuation, and undercurrent, unless the base is the centerpiece, or it should be as varied as the rest of the instrumentation.  I think the Mass Effect pieces use base appropriately and effectively. It even has good use of a theremin. :D

Now for something classic that perfectly fits Star Trek. The "American Collection".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIvrFc4S_hY

"Fanfare for the Common Man" definitely fits as well, and to some extent I think "Simple Gifts" does as well. Although, neither is lively enough.
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Offline BrioCyrain

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2011, 02:54:55 PM »
Since we're suggesting, I hope you go out on a limb with the music and break from purely classical themes.  My favorite game music is Mass Effect's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2dnp1x38mg&feature=related

The worst thing in music today is the overuse of base.  Just about everything keeps rhythm with a base line, and all it does is distract from the music. I think base should only be used as punctuation, and undercurrent, unless the base is the centerpiece, or it should be as varied as the rest of the instrumentation.  I think the Mass Effect pieces use base appropriately and effectively. It even has good use of a theremin. :D

Now for something classic that perfectly fits Star Trek. The "American Collection".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIvrFc4S_hY

"Fanfare for the Common Man" definitely fits as well, and to some extent I think "Simple Gifts" does as well. Although, neither is lively enough.

Mass Effect's music seems pretty much similar to many other Sci-fi games, definitely the heave use of "Sci-fi instruments". If you don't believe me you can look up games like "Derek Smart's Universal Combat" and you will get what I mean. Not that it's bad music or anything...just making an observation given how people give Mass Effect credit for being "unique" when in actuality it is pretty much the "embodiment" of almost all sci-fi movie and video game material.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x89iQDokvmQ

Another suggested piece, from Medal of Honor series

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Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2011, 09:05:13 AM »
I found a song that needs to be in the game, I don't care how convoluted and contrived the plot needs to be to get it in, it just needs to be in there.  :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3u9e0hwjWo#t=1m

Also.
http://games.adultswim.com/robot-unicorn-attack-twitchy-online-game.html
http://games.adultswim.com/robot-unicorn-attack-heavy-metal-twitchy-online-game.html
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Offline Johannes

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2011, 01:36:55 AM »
Sorry for not replying lately...was a bit busy at work.

I had a question about the music and sound effects.  Will we be getting access to all the sound/music stuff once things come out and will files be labled accordingly?  I hate it when digging through files in a game and the files are just named random crap!  lol

This is something that I am actually not yet sure about. As the music system will very dynamic the music itself will probably come in hundreds of tiny music segments (just a few seconds each). And even then I am not sure if it will be completely accessible. I guess we should think about releasing some kind of album once it is completed...with proper file names and tags of course. ;)

Sound effects is a different story, it's actually not my site. :(

@all: thanks for the links! I got the Mass Effect 1 score myself and it is quite good. Yes, it draws from other sci fi franchises in terms of sound effects and instrumentation, but still I think it is quite a very diverse and unique approach to such an epic story. I'm still getting sick when I remember to the Thorian theme...

@FekLeyrTarg : THANKS DUDE!!!

@majorD: the TES5 trailer ain't exaclty a song! Would you like to have a real song in the game? Like an official Excalibur song...you know for the end credits maybe after the big orchestra played? It worked pretty well in the Lord of the Rings trilogy ... ;)

Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2011, 03:01:50 AM »
Nah, I just think there needs to be dudes, other than Klingons, singing in the game.  Although, the Klingon opera thing from Klingon Academy was great, there hasn't been a Trek song that good in a long time.  Actually, now that I hear it again, it's a little off, but overall still good, and that's not the only song in the game to use a choir.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZnEBT1pAtM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upxwVHtzlcg&feature=related

There is one particular type of music I've been looking for for a long time, shouting choir. It's some sort of Scandinavian style, but I can't find anything on it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNTVzwjEyb4&feature=related

:lol:

[edit!!!] I found it, after years of searching!
http://www.vagabondish.com/finlands-shouting-mens-choir/
« Last Edit: March 03, 2011, 03:12:26 AM by MajorD »
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Offline MajorD

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Re: Music of Excalibur
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2011, 10:46:14 AM »
It's been years since I thought about this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJiKPZ2OoVg

And this. Same artist. Susumu Hirasawa.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4M_3igofTZg&feature=artist&playnext=1&list=AVGxdCwVVULXed8SiJjTWQ4WB5sWhU_6g8

They kind of remind me of the Farscape and Andromeda themes, and maybe the Earth: Final Conflict theme.
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