Warp Core - Coil Flashing: Speed not Strength

[Jon]

Erm, ignite into a warp field?  Not sure how that would work.
It was my understanding that the plasma powered the coils which generate the field. Not the coils controlling the plasma.

[MajorD]

You're right, he did say the coils ignite the plasma. It should be the other way, unless the warp plasma itself causes the warp field effect and the coils are there to control the plasma. That's actually somewhat plausible, I recall warp plasma being different form normal plasma for some reason.

[Aresius]

Or that way, I'm not sure how a coil can do anything to or with plasma.

That's the nacelles interior. To the right is the pedestal from which the plasma-steams join and then wander along the centre of the nacelle. Now my question about the powered-by-plasma idea is: How does plasma, or any energy-carrier power something if it doesn't touch it or an energy-processing component or even float near it?

[MajorD]

I thought I knew, but I wasn't sure and it took me hours to find the answer. As I thought, to some extent, it has to do with neutrons. Neutrons created during the fusion process get absorbed by a lithium blanket. This blanket material heats, the heat is captured by a fluid (water), that transfers it to a converter (a turbine, a Stirling engine, or perhaps something else), and it is turned into electricity. Neutrons->Thermal->Mechanical->Electrical. One very interesting thing about dilithium is that it can turn thermal energy into mechanical energy, vaguely like an electrical charge run through quarts creates mechanical movement. Remember that episode about Data making an alien friend by radio and the alien's world going to blow itself up, and Picard not wanting to help? That's the episode.

Another way to get the energy is to let the plasma heat the walls of the reactor with contact, and let the walls heat a fluid. But, that's hardly practical, unless you have materials that can handle tens of millions of degrees.

Thermal conversion of a dilithium layer in the warp coils is a possibility, it seems the most likely to me. Alternatively, the closest I can think of is the anti-matter reaction in the warp core creates neutrons and thermal energy, both get captured and turned into electricity which is conducted along the super hot plasma. The plasma is then a conduction method, and nothing more.

I originally though the coils could harvest energy magnetically, since plasma can be effected that way, but that means the plasma would need to carry energy kinetically. There is no indication of it being a possibility and it feels wrong.

Lastly, the reactions all are supposed to take place in the warp core. If there was a fusion reaction going on in the warp engines then we might be able to say the coils are harvesting neutrons, but that doesn't fit. So, one of the earlier possibilities, either thermal conversion or electrical conduction seem the most likely.

[MajorD]

I made a mistake, kinetically capturing the energy is a sensible way to do this. It's called a 'direct energy converter' and works like a reverse linear accelerator.

http://www.askmar.com/Direct_Energy.html

Electrostatic direct energy converters are linear accelerators run backwards, e.g. fast ions enter the “exit” of the accelerator, are decelerated by retarding electric fields, and collected on high-voltage electrodes forming the positive terminal of the direct energy converter power source.

This may be what the warp engines are doing. It seems the most practical to me now, and it explains why they're long, but also explains how round ones work, and why there is a large device at the opposite end of the warp engine in the previous picture. It's the capture point for the plasma. It means nothing has to touch, and no special charge is needed. It also means the warp core only has to make plasma, rather than neutrons or have a turbine hidden somewhere. It might also explain why the nacelles constantly glow in TNG and later, they may be the actual electrical source for the ship. Although, I seem to remember the warp core having a converter of its own.

[Aresius]

Ah, quite good points. Thanks for the idea.

Yes, the episode is Penpals.

Well, they do ahve this aweful plasma coolant that ruls along the E-Es core, which disintegrates organic material on contact, but do you think that the "heat" that fluiud?
I would imagine that such a lethal fluid would be even more dangerous when heated (i.e. added energy and thus more reactive).

[MajorD]

I'm not sure what you're saying but the stuff can already instantly dissolve flesh on contact, so heating it won't make it worse. I don't know why they call it plasma coolant instead of coolant, the stuff is obviously for the warp core. When the deflector was used as a cannon, it was the coolant that ran out and limited how long it could fire.

[MajorD]

Let's see what we have so far.

Inside the warp core, matter (deuterium ) and anti-matter (anti-deuterium) somehow pass through the dilithium and react inside it, heating the dilithium. Or, the anti-matter reacts with the dilithium, heating it. Additional deuterium is thrown at the dilithium, causing the deuterium to turn into deuterium plasma by way of heat, while a portion of the energy captured by the dilithium is converted right into electricity thanks to the properties of the dilithium to convert thermal into mechanical energy. Other various radiations are converted into additional electricity inside the warp core by other means.

Some plasma is used as a low resistance, high capacity, conductor for the entire ship for low power systems. High power systems use the plasma itself in direct energy converters.

Other plasma is directed directly to the warp engines, which act like huge reverse linear accelerators (direct energy converters).

I left anything about warp fields out of it because we didn't come up with anything really good concerning that aspect. But, I think the stuff on power generation and is very good.

[Black Patriot]

I agree, the theory you've proposed makes sense based on all the canon evidence I'm aware of. I'm not sure how we'd address the way the warp coils function, besides them being a currently unknown exotic material that naturally creates subspace fields when subjected to energy. That could also make the repair/replacement of warp coils difficult, at least if they're made of a material that can't be replicated, which would be reasonable since starships regularly have to return to a drydock and have their coils at least refurbished, if not replaced (we see Voyager manage this on it's own).

[MajorD]

I would like the warp coils to be a completely artificial material, such as some sort of organic conducting ceramic fiber thing. I dislike the idea of them incorporating dilithium because it means Cochrane had to have had dilithium to make his ship. He already had anti-matter as indicated by a particular radiation Data detected leaking from the Pheonix, so any further into standard Trek tech would be pushing things too far in my opinion. He could have used a tungstun target to shoot anti-protons at and use the target to heat reaction mass for fuel to power the warp drive and rocket engine. That fits with lower performance. We also know you don't need anti-matter for warp drive, there was at least one fusion powered alien ship in TNG, and in TOS the Romulans "only have impulse power" as Scotty said. I take that to mean they had fusion, rather than lacking warp drive which doesn't make sense.

We're still left with two kinds of warp coil; arches in engines and plates in cores. Unlike the arch style, I think the disc style probably use thermal conduction by coming in contact with plasma in order to gather energy. Although, it could run off electricity or stray radiation.

I don't know why it took me so long to realize, but they must have originally used "lithium" in TOS because it was going to be the material used in fusion reactors to harvest neutrons for power production. That indicates dilithium being a capture medium for energy. And, as lithium tantalate, lithium is piezoelectric and pyroelectric. The latter meaning it produces electricity when heated and cooled.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_tantalate

[Black Patriot]

I would like the warp coils to be a completely artificial material, such as some sort of organic conducting ceramic fiber thing. I dislike the idea of them incorporating dilithium because it means Cochrane had to have had dilithium to make his ship. He already had anti-matter as indicated by a particular radiation Data detected leaking from the Pheonix, so any further into standard Trek tech would be pushing things too far in my opinion. He could have used a tungstun target to shoot anti-protons at and use the target to heat reaction mass for fuel to power the warp drive and rocket engine. That fits with lower performance. We also know you don't need anti-matter for warp drive, there was at least one fusion powered alien ship in TNG, and in TOS the Romulans "only have impulse power" as Scotty said. I take that to mean they had fusion, rather than lacking warp drive which doesn't make sense.

The coils in the phoenix could have been made of an inferior but much more available material. There could be many materials that can produce a warp field, just that the ones used on the phoenix weren't very good (ie if used in a full size ship then it wouldn't go very fast, or would be very inefficient, much like using lead to build an engine instead of steel. It would probably work, but I doubt if it would be very good).

Also, Scotty's statement could also have indicated that they were using a technology for power generation that he couldn't recognize. Since the Romulan's use of artificial quantum singularities wasn't widely known about till the 24th century, it would be safe to assume that they were using them as a power source. Either that or they had a very large fusion reactor.

[Jon]

I think the confusion between warp core warp coils and those in the nacelles is down to function.

The coils in the core probably deliver the materials to the injectors or modify the warp plasma in some way after creation, allowing the nacelles to produce a different type of field (i.e. transwarp etc)

The ones in the nacelles produce the warp field for the ship, and could probably produce many different types of field depending on the type of power supplied (i.e. for transwarp).

Seems a reasonable explanation and would fit in with canon.

[Poseidon]

I think the confusion between warp core warp coils and those in the nacelles is down to function.

The coils in the core probably deliver the materials to the injectors or modify the warp plasma in some way after creation, allowing the nacelles to produce a different type of field (i.e. transwarp etc)

The ones in the nacelles produce the warp field for the ship, and could probably produce many different types of field depending on the type of power supplied (i.e. for transwarp).

Seems a reasonable explanation and would fit in with canon.

Hey El,

I think a lot of the techno babble of Star Trek has to do with the extension of RL technology and there terms.  How I based my evaluation of engineering for my mod is to include as many "functioning" systems and there terms.  The warp coils are (much like RL coils) increase the plasma streams per warp power output, that is part of a system which provides system/subsystems power.  Think of it as transformer, where the power is stepped up, or down, from the warp core, which is one of the components that helps provide power to subsystems (lifesupport, transporters, ect.)  It can also increase warp field power output (per gigajual).  At least, that is how I will approach many controllable systems in engineering.  The way I see it, there are at least 22 different systems that power and regulate the warp core.  All 22 of them will be configurable in my mod, along with many other things that are configurable, like shields and phasers and the deflector dish, ect. ect. 

[zzz]

the episode Gambit gives some interesting info on how the intermix ratio affects the speed and rate of plasma generation, and exactly how high speeds end up damaging warp engines. also shows the Ops console reconfigured for an enemy target lock.

[MajorD]

This episode is a gold mine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHoQnJxtIEo&NR=1
The mercenary ship went warp 8.6.
3:18
Engineer: Two of the power shunts are on the verge of collapse and we'll be lucky if we can maintain warp six.
Captain: How long will it take to repair.
Engineer: I can try to realign the warp core, it will take eleven hours, but I'll have to shut the engines down completely.
Captain: We can't afford to be sitting helpless in space. I want warp 8 in five hours and I don't want your excuses.

Captain: What's going on?
Engineer: I'm bypassing the aft plasma couplings. Power loss should only last a few seconds.

7:24 warp suddenly gets J.J. Abrams!
Woman: We're accelerating!
Captain: What have you done?
Engineer: It has nothing to do with my repairs. I think there is a malfunction in the engine's intermix chamber.
Romulan Woman: Plasma pressure is rising.
Captain: Where's the malfunction?
Engineer: It could be one of any thirty subsystems, it'll take time to locate.
Romulan Woman: I don't think you're going to have the chance, plasma pressure's reached critical levels.
Captain: Seal off the intermix chamber.
Woman: I can't, the override sequence won't engage.
Picard/Galen: The antimatter flow regulator is locked open.
A Woman: Logic sub systems still not responding.
Romulan Woman: Plasma pressure has exceeded maximum levels. 8% above critical and rising.
Engineer: We have to jettison the core.
Captain: No, we'll be stranded here!
Picard: The flow regulator is frozen.
Riker: Let me do it. I've had a lot of experience with sort of systems failure, I might be able to do something.
Romulan Woman: Plasma pressure is 11% above critical; the containment fields are beginning to degrade.
Captain: Go!
Engineer: Flow regulator is not responding to manual override, containment fields won't hold much longer.
Riker: Looks like you've got a control regulator lock out in your logic subsystem. Going to attempt to run an active bypass.

[MajorD]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEoxmiZWldk&NR=1

Riker: Start running phase lock feedback through that regulator and I want about a six second delay.

Romulan: Plasma pressure is 14% above critical. Plasma pressure is dropping.

Wow, the Debrune are an ancient off shoot of the Romulans from 2,000 years ago, and the mercenaries can activate their transporter with their weapons by shooting at targets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYxI3OAwsTc
3:22
Captain: What are you doing?
Picard: I'm configuring the disruptors to fire a phased resonance pulse. If I can hit their shield generator with precisely the right frequency I should be able to take it out with one shot.
Firing.
Their shields are down.
4:02
Picard: They managed to get their shields up.

This fits with how the E-D's shields were disrupted by a few hundred watts (pethetically little energy) by Uxbridge's summoned ship, and the shields came back in short order. The shields didn't actually take damage, it would seem.

5:40
Riker uses personal command codes on the mercenary ship to take over the Enterprise-D! Troi says he would know those codes would be changed as soon as he was captured. So, if they weren't changed they would work, but the goal was a ruse.

The episode ends with the mercenary ship firing on the Enterprise-D's warp nacelle. I'm going to assume it doesn't explode in Part 2.

[MajorD]

Gambit Part 2, 1 of 5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4I4qA7YUtI&feature=related

The first 2 minutes 30 seconds show us how the battle would go if it were real, even though it was actually faked on both sides.

That's a great episode.

[Poseidon]

All of these are great source material, but I have already included them in most of my systems/subsystem configurations.  Procedures have also been mapped out.  You will find some episodes are in conflict with others dealing with proceedures, but I think I have struck a common ground.  Also, some procedures will be modifyable.  Great feed back guys!